Maybe it’s a pipe trick, but I want people to understand Blockchain, at least enough that they’ll be prepared when it completely not. Yeah, when it completely wipes out our understanding of the internet, the content presented on this podcast does not in any way represent investment advice. The information is provided for educational and entertainment purposes. Crypto assets are considered risky investments. You should always do your own research before investing the opinions expressed here do not represent those of Coin desk’s editorial staff, TJ Miller needs absolutely no introduction. And with Two Ns, it doesn’t either. I’ve been watching your show for quite a while. I’m, I am such a crypto guy and I, and I’m not like meme coins. But um I just, I’m so fascinated by the space. So I’ve watched you many, many, I’ve done uh a gen rabbit hole where I just put you on and watch and it’s next and a lot of it is, you know, months past it doesn’t, it doesn’t even relate to the current crypto market, but I’ll just watch and watch and watch and then follow the uh, so what’s your, what’s your favorite interview? Oh, my God. How could I even choose? But I like it when you interview the big ones, you know, when you go down a rabbit hole it becomes a blur. It’s like, yeah. But I love how you, the other thing that I really love because I was watching today is I love, sometimes you’ll sneak in, like, well, what do you, what do you think of the economy right now? Like, what’s going on in a recession and then you, who you’re interviewing goes? Well, I’m, I’m not, I’m not into macroeconomics and you’re kind of like, yeah, but still, what do you think? And I, I like how you’re always kind of getting a little bit more from all of your guests. Oh, well, thank you. I appreciate that. That’s not financial advice. What do you think of the economy right now? Are you? I cannot offer any, no financial advice. It’s true. We got Wendy’s now has a deal that is $9 in New York City for a combo meal. And, uh, was it PF Chang said lunch special, $17.95. And I think, and we, we should talk about ordinals, of course. But I think I have two theories. One is that around July, mid July, everyone in America all in one moment said I thought I would have more money than I do right now. And I just think that hits for some reason, like a shock wave. I think all of America was like, wait a second, like a few months ago. I thought for sure. I was certain that I would have more money than I do. Now. Something seems off and then now it’s much more visible, I think. And we’re gonna see August be more visible. And then my other theory is that right now everyone is, you know, they see the price of eggs, the price of milk. And I live in New York City. And so sometimes all of us are the last to kind of go, wait, wait a second. But I just think everyone now has settled into the idea that OK, inflation is real in the sense that everything is gonna cost more and we all have to adjust the way we look at our salary or in my case, the pittance that I get paid when I work. And I think it’s really interesting because the other thing I think people are realizing is like, maybe I should work a little bit more and that’s what a recession looks like. It’s, I should spend a little bit less, but maybe I have to work more. And that’s a tough thing to work out, especially for Americans who are advertised at. I don’t think we see advertisements I think we are advertised at because we’re so good at capitalism. Well, you’re working more, aren’t you? Yeah, you’re a lot more. I feel like you’re working a lot more. You’re out at the Bitcoin conference. You launched this late your latest NFT project on ordinals. I feel like you’re doing. This is what makes a great host. You just did a segue into what we were supposed to talk about from when I was off into my A DH D land. That’s why I like you. That’s why everybody considers you the real deal with two. Well, I love that you’re gonna have to help me launch an NFT collection for all of my fans. I suspect that you may be probably the only one, but I would love to have you in my community if you’re gonna, if you are willing to help me, I am more than willing to help you. I Yeah, that space I thought was really interesting to me after I had, I’m not, I don’t know, sort of what you hold in ho but I am not a Bitcoin maxi, but nearly so I hold Bitcoin and Ethereum now on the Ethereum Chain, NFTS became this thing that suddenly exploded and was so interesting and it was just new. It suddenly was Cryptocurrency went from or Blockchain went from kind of an investment opportunity for artists or entertainers. When NFT sort of arose, we all go wait a second. If you’re really forward thinking, you could make a, a movie is what Kevin Smith did, but you could make your own art project you could make, this was far before I even thought of doing an actual comedy special, but you could put video or things that you wanted. And I’m starting early in ordinals. So right now it’s just images. But my first nfts, which I did in 2020 were um based on my stand up, but it was like an animated slot machine with several different movies that I had done. And then I did another one which is a Rubik’s Cube that slowly solved itself and became the punch line to one of my stand up specials. And so those two things I thought were an intersection between what was being done with NFTS in the space at the time. And then me as a comedian because I was the first comedian to Mint NFTS. Nobody else kind of was even thinking about that. And I have a story from the NFT special. I, I wanted to, I wanted to ask you about that because I’m curious about the comedians who you talk to the comedians you see every night when you’re performing, when you tell them about your NFT projects. What’s the reception like? Like are they interested? Do they think it’s kind of useless? Like, do they get it now? I love this question. I mean, it’s a double NJ and we knew it from the start. I uh I mean, this is me, this is what I have fun. I like to uh I’ll, I’ll take it to. So, yeah, and I, I’d love to talk about the ordinals because of the Bitcoin space and because they’re available right now, but I just completed uh the first stand up comedy special as an NFT. And sometimes when I say it was the first do this, it was the first, it feels like, oh I’m trying to brag that. But it, it’s more confusing to me that people haven’t explored this space, they don’t know what’s going on. So I shot uh a stand up comedy special. I think it’s running about 20 minutes long. We’re in the final phase of editing and that will be minted as an NFT and then we’ll figure out where it’s gonna go. Um, Nifty Gateway is kind of transitioning and figure out what they’re gonna do. But that’s, they minted my first NFT si have a little bit of loyalty to them and The Winkle by. But, um, I finished this special and I was done with it. And afterwards I was talking to a couple comedians, really comedians of note, like big comedians in the New York scene and nationally and these guys are doing theaters and stuff. And so I thought, oh, maybe they’ll be interested in doing one, right. So I said to them, yeah, it’s, it’s gonna be an NFT. There are about three of these guys there and they go. So, so you don’t put it on youtube and I go, no, no, no, it’s an asset. So people buy it and it’s theirs and then they own it there. You go, well, what prevents them from putting it on youtube? And I said, well, it would devalue their asset. The scarcity is the main thing that is, you know, important about it or valuable about it, which we’ll talk about how ordinals level up on that because that’s what Bitcoin is times 10. And they said, so nobody’s gonna put it on youtube. You don’t think I go, I mean, I’m not sure of that but no, and irregardless the people that own the NFT of the special. That’s theirs, right? And then anybody else that sees it is just seeing a copy of the NFT and then you just look in their eyes and you see their mind just melt into their thre because what is also ironic about this is my closing joke in this special is about NFTS and trying to explain NFTS to like your parents or somebody outside of the space. And it’s just so funny because they cannot understand it. And my joke is about me explaining it to my father who kind of doesn’t get it, doesn’t get it and then suddenly still doesn’t get it and then kind of flips it for some glimmer there at the, we all, we all want, this is what I love about the crypto space, the Blockchain space. We all want people to understand it. None of us who are fighting the good fight, none of us are going uh Well, idiot you don’t understand So you’ll never get it. Not allowed in our club. That’s not what we’re trying to do. We’re trying, especially in Bitcoin, but also on the E chain, we’re trying to say, listen, this is the future. OK? There’s no denying it. It is currently happening and it’s happening very quickly. We’d like to explain it to you and we think that you should buy Bitcoin or understand E or whatever. And that was, let’s start there. And it’s just so complicated. And my other theory just really quickly is Blockchain itself. And Bitcoin takes about 50 hours of research. 50 to really understand it. It’s very difficult to get people to study. Once they’re out of school, they’re fatigued by it. What do you think of that? Do you think? That’s right. I think it is hard to get people to study. But I also think that maybe people don’t need to know how things work if they can get something from it or they can understand the value, maybe they don’t need to study the actual thing. I think that’s right. And I understand what you’re saying completely but, and I feel ok trashing them. But then they’re in, then, then they’re in meme coin world, they’re gonna get Doja or Pepe because they heard that that’s gonna make a bunch of money. Whereas someone like us, I think is gonna say what is going on with the Salon of Blockchain. It seems different than proof of stake or proof of work. So I, maybe, maybe it’s, maybe it’s a pipe trick but I want people to understand Blockchain. At least enough that they’ll be prepared when it completely not. Yeah, when it completely wipes out our understanding of the internet. Yeah, I think, I agree with you. If it comes to an investment you should understand what’s going on. If you’re going to invest, get a meme coin or something. But I think more if we’re talking about like NFTS in the way that you’ve launched them as you know, um entrance into a community, a collectible ownership of this asset of this creator. You love maybe people who are entering that way, don’t need to understand the fundamentals to still get the value. You’re right. But you’re absolutely right because people that collect pop funko dolls don’t necessarily know how they’re made or where they’re made or what plastic is used or any of that. But if you’re to buy an NFT, you should understand what NFT stands for. Kind of to understand a non fungible token, then you’ve kind of got to understand the Blockchain and to understand something that’s fungible, then you kind of have to understand fiat. And so it is, it’s that rabbit hole that all of us have gone down. But I agree with you and I won’t talk about it anymore because I’m afraid of Victor. Yeah, everyone should have a little bit of fear of Victor. That’s how the show, uh looks and sounds so good. Now, tell me TJ, we talked a little bit about the comedians in your network. The NFTS are really for your community. People who love the content that you create. How do you go about that education and getting them to really understand what’s going on here and what they’re buying into? Well, I think right now it’s very difficult for me to say to my fans at large, you should check out my NFT because they then say, well, where and in this case with my ordinals, it’s TJ dot Cred. Kred because Cred is the one that minted these ordinals, but I’m mostly sort of playing to not audience, but maybe, yeah, an audience who are buying these things that already know about all this. So it’s still a very niche group of people that the Venn diagram intersects between the ordinal me and people who understand and trade ordinals. So that I think is kind of interesting and we’re, I’m sort of understanding what is the appetite in the market for ordinals right now that intersects with me. And also what is the current market stance? So when I was selling my NFT, we were in just a white hot uh bull market and NFTS were really something that was of interest. People were buying and selling, they were thinking you can make money off of it. What I was really happy about is people were, you know, in NFTS, there’s something that isn’t the case in ordinals because MTs can be associated with a smart contract. So then every time they’re sold, the creator gets a residual. So we call in Hollywood, but it would be sort of a kick back of 10% of the sale goes to the original creator. And I thought, well, this is fantastic because residuals have all but disappeared in Hollywood. So this would be a great way once people start making things, artists, all kinds of people, um they, they can get a residual. But then when I found out is if people really like the asset, then they’re gonna keep the NFT, they’re gonna keep it as part of their, you know, collection. And so that was an interesting thing too where if you make something great, people won’t necessarily wanna trade it. You know, if that’s, if that’s the way that if that’s the market of it’s like baseball cards, you know, and then if you make a movie or a comedy special and it’s an NFT, then when somebody buys it, they love the comedy special, then they’re gonna keep it. And then maybe if they think, ok, I’ve seen this a couple of times, then maybe they’ll sell it. But if it’s an ordinal, then there won’t be that sort of return. And so it’s still a very new space. I just think we, people like myself, which there really aren’t any others of note. You, you’re kind of figuring the space out along as you go. You’re just saying what, what is this thing? What am I? It feels like the Lumiere Brothers when film started becoming a thing and people would go to a Nickelodeon, pay a nickel and say like, what, what, you know, what will people want to see? Is it a train crashing? Is it a horse galloping? That was how new film was and how they were trying to figure out the audience? OK. So it sounds like you consider yourself a bit of a pioneer in the NFT space and the creating communities using the technology. I have to ask. Yeah. Well, yeah, I think so. I think anyone who is experimenting in the space the way you are, is, is really pioneering. Something that maybe all of us don’t know what it’s gonna look like in the future. But I think that it will be embedded into community uh somehow some way. But I have to ask you, I know we only have a few minutes left. I need to ask you about fortune because we spoke about it so much on this show and it was announced um It incorporates NFTS into the creative process in a different way that we’re talking about. Now, you of course, star um in the show, what progress has been made there? When is it coming to life? How do we get to watch the show and participate? Well, like many sort of start ups because I feel like sometimes everything is a start up. Do you ever feel like that? Everything everybody is talking about? Right. Kind of, I really do. Yeah. Yeah. Every one of your friends in the tech world, every, everybody, everybody has a start up, they’re part of a start up. They’re a component of start up and like a lot of start up Fortune and Tun Star, which is pro, it kind of feels like a start up that stalled out a little bit. So they’re looking for their series c probably is how you would say it. Um And yeah, we’re just waiting for that to happen and I think it’ll come because it’s gonna be great before, before we get out of this because I just wanna talk about this is these ordinals that were minted by Cred and that you can get on TJ Miller dot Cred are three of my tour posters, my most popular tour posters and they’re sort of, it’s collectibles, it’s a single image because there’s not a lot of room on Bitcoin to inscribe, you know, and so you also have to pay to inscribe whereas minting can be something that people do for a percentage of it. Um But ordinals is a completely new space, almost, no one is inscribing them with anything but an image. And so this is my first time saying, OK, I’m a comedian. I’m a bit Coiner, you know, what is the appetite or interest for ordinals. And, you know, do you want to collect them? You should, I think as the first ordinals by a comedian and this space is very different from NFTS. But it is exciting because it’s an NFT for Bitcoin Maxis or Bitcoin or, or people that wanna understand that space and see some sort of entertainment or art come into the space. And I think it’s really cool because I think what it’s doing is Bitcoin in some ways, once Ethereum came to prominence Bitcoin, a lot of people in Blockchain and crypto kind of like, well, that’s old news. That’s the old, that’s, you know, that’s, that’s bags of gold and right now we’re not doing, you know, we’re making things out of silver and we’re able to, it’s much more malleable. And so I really like that. Now there’s an opportunity to create an NFT like asset on the Bitcoin Blockchain because it elevates Bitcoin back to this is the original Blockchain, but it has use case scenarios. It has the ability for people to create on it. So that’s exciting. That’s why these three posters I think will be really a collectible years from now because they’ll be able to say, yeah, I got this first thing and it was, it’s the first by a comedian. So I’m excited about that. I’m excited about ordinals and it’s just such a new space that we’re kind of figuring out and because it’s hard to get Bitcoins and especially Bitcoin maxis to part with their Bitcoin because everybody buys holes and doesn’t sell. But I think you’re gonna find these things to be valuable enough that you can sell them for more Bitcoin so we can look at it that way down the road. TJ. Congratulations on the launch. I will be following along. I wish you the most success and I can’t wait to see what you do next. Thanks so much for joining the show, Jen. Thank you so much. I love that. It’s a double N Jen. And you asked me earlier what my fav I just remembered what my favorite interview of yours was and it’s this one. Thank you. I love that.
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